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Soul of the Forest and 10 Man Raids

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Question for the resto druids in 10 man raiding, how often do you not take Soul of the Forest for a given boss? (Presuming that need for Incarnation as a mana saving CD is largely unneeded by this point for most). Having played resto since classic, and being used to Tree of Life since BC, it took me a long time to even try out Soul (hated giving up a signature ability). That being said, short of fights with movement heavy phases needing healing (Blade Lord and Lei Shi), I'm finding that I'm always using Soul do the massive healing boost to Wind Growth, since glyphed Wild Growth hits 60% of my raid (I should note I'm running at the 6652 haste break point as well). The extra healing available every 15s (yeah, I haven't gotten to 4 piece normal tier yet) seems to significantly out perform the extra healing for Incarnation every 3m.

Others have similar experiences?
Traylon
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Posted Feb 23, 13 · OP
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I haven't played with SotF since Dragon Soul. It was great on the Deathwing fight, but I really missed having the second cooldown on other fights. I hadn't thought about it in ages... Of the 16 bosses this tier, I find that I liked having Tree+NV on 10 of them when they were progression. Another thing, and this is probably just me, but I haven't been getting that much mileage out of WG in 10-man.
Posted Feb 24, 13
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Oleander wrote:
Of the 16 bosses this tier, I find that I liked having Tree+NV on 10 of them when they were progression. Another thing, and this is probably just me, but I haven't been getting that much mileage out of WG in 10-man.

Honestly, I was the same way (though not about WG; I've always big a big user of that). I just couldn't see giving up the extra CD of Tree. Then, I think it was when our raid decided we needed to 2 heal Vizer in HoF to beat the enrage (our DPS had a ton of troubles living through circles; so we typically we're down 1 after phase 2). Tree just wasn't cutting it for the multiple Force and Verbs in p3, depending on RNG. So I tried out Soul and the boost to my HPS for the entire fight was gigantic. After that, I started using it on any fight with a lot of constant raid damage (which is most in T14) and the difference was pretty amazing HPS wise (we 2 heal everything but Ambershaper, Empress, and Tsulong, so far).

Maybe it just fits my play style really well along with my raid's desire to 2 heal everything we can to take pressure off the DPS.
Traylon
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Posted Feb 24, 13 · OP
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I think a lot depends also on your healing partner and their class. I'm Disc and the way things are currently my druid partner barely has anything to do even in Vizier when we 2heal it. In fact last night she was even innervating me on the second platform cause she was at full mana.

4th phase gets a bit hairy but nothing the multiple Disc cds can't handle.

Ok this ended up more being me bragging, but my point is a lot can depend on your combo.
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Posted Feb 24, 13
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I m a druid 568 ilvl and playing in a 10 man Raid , i was with 13 163 Hast , and one of the best druid heal of my server is playing with 6652 hast breakpoint and max masteries. I'll try tonight on Soo Hm (malkorok) if this "spec" is better or not.

As we said it really depend on your dual healer. I play with a paladin so that's why i ll try the masteries spec.

I also have 41.41% masteries with "Incarnation" to get 15% heal and a mana regen and with "Heart of the Wild" which provide a 25% bonus heal (not writen on the spell , thx blizzard) and for sure the +6% passiv intellect bonus.
Posted Apr 27, 14
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I haven't used Soul of the Forest at all this tier. In fact, I haven't really changed talents per fight, it's just been Displacer, Ysera, Typhoon, Incarnation, Bash, Heart of the Wild.

The only one I feel I should experiment with is Heart of the Wild vs Nature's Vigil, as another throughput CD would be pretty handy on H Thok. But then again, so is 6% stamina and intellect...
Posted Apr 27, 14
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How do I tell my resto druid that SotF is not as good as ToL for SoO HM? He's convinced that he's doing well :(
Posted Apr 28, 14
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SotF is best when Wild Growth is a big portion of your healing for a long time. The ability to make Efflorescence "permanent" in 5.4 had the effect of diminishing Wild Growth's percentage in our aoe healing on a lot of fights, which rebalanced SotF versus other talents. I suspect many people who are with SotF now are used to SotF from before 5.4.

Very few fights in SoO have the sustained AOE that benefits SotF. Most of the fights have very bursty aoe healing, which favors having a CD to cover it. Like Immerseus, SotF's effect is useful for the first couple of times that Immerseus is up, but useless the rest of the fight. Those times can be just as well (or better) covered with Incarnation and Tranquility. And then Incarnation is useful during the later split phases, where it can allow you to heal up a couple extra puddles.

H Thok (which we just started progression on) would be the best use of SotF in all of SoO, I think, as it has four aoe heal phases, two of which are 90s long. You can't cover all that with 3 minute cooldowns. If you just consider those 90s ones, being that those are the ones you're actually trying to push the healing on, SotF and Incarnation are really close on throughput. Doing some math on my healing numbers from one of our better attempts, I did 24,547,853 healing during the first stack phase with Incarnation. I figure I would have done 24,312,015 with SotF.

And that's just considering raw throughput. Incarnation has other benefits! Several fights, (H Thok, H Sha, and H Juggernaut come immediately to mind) have heavy healing periods that also make it hard to cast Regrowth. For my raid, at least, being able to turn Regrowth instant during these phases is the difference between people dying or not, and that's more important than throughput!

Maybe if you were trying to solo heal Norushen, SotF would be good?

But using SotF doesn't mean you're not "doing well"
Posted Apr 29, 14
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My raid group isn't doing SoO heroic modes yet (we're not that motivated to stack heavily for it), so take this feedback with that in mind.

I've been using Force of Nature for fights with heavy stacking or no pure CD healing phases over Tree (Sha of Fear, General, Spoils, Thok, Garrosh) and having very good success (2 healing all fights of course). They key feeling FoN is nearly always available with 1-2 charges given the short recharge time and each Ent drops Efflorescence. Which means in stacking phases like Thok, I've got 4 overlapped Efflorescence going on every stack phase; Garrosh, I've got 3 stacked Efflorescence for every whirl, etc. Force of Nature is actually a much better talent in those situations than I realized through the previous tiers when I never used it.

I've also gotten good use out FoN on Blackfuse at times when I get picked to kite a laser (drop 3 Ents, let them heal while I'm running), but its a bit more questionable there since having ToL for a Magnet phase is also very good. (It really depends on whether we're always killing magnets or mines that attempt, we tend to switch up).
Traylon
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Posted May 4, 14 · OP
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